‘Many don’t understand their motivation’: UNICS’ Lazarev on esports athletes, a hiatus in his career, and winning the championship

While esports are developing rapidly, some things still need time to take shape, basketball player Ivan Lazarev, who is taking part in the Games of the Future, has told RT. He says gamers live in a world of their own and won’t recognize a professional athlete as an authority figure. The three-time champion of the VTB United League told RT why he decided to resume his career after an 18-month pause, recalled his EuroLeague victory with CSKA, and shared his dream of promoting his own teambuilding course.

‘I don’t even know all the rules’

— You’re one of the few professional athletes at the Games of the Future who is deeply involved with the cyber industry. Do you consider yourself a guide into the world of esports?

— I’ve worked in other areas, after all. You can’t lump everything together. Otherwise, it would be like saying, “Oh, you’re a computer guy? Can you fix my fridge?” In esports, there are unique athletes and disciplines, although I am meeting here some of the guys I know. I’ve worked with some, others have written about competitions. I’m trying to explain why people act in a certain way and can have a closed personality. What character traits and values they have.

— Are you talking about cyber athletes?

— Yes. Many don’t understand their motivation, although it’s quite simple. We’re talking about typical human stories here. Outsiders often think cyber athletes have trouble socializing, but that’s exactly why they’re using games to socialize because they may find it difficult to connect to others in the real world. Some have problems with their parents.

— How hard was it for you to adapt to two-on-two play?

— No big deal, although it is a challenging format. In the first game, we lost at the virtual stage, so we were trying to catch up in the physical round. It didn’t go well, we were short on time. It’s quite hard to close a 12-point gap in seven minutes of two-on-two play. We were having trouble with our 3-pointers, many shots went off the mark. But we kept fighting. It was the first experience of that kind for everyone. The other guys had played in the qualifications, but for me, it was a complete first. I don’t even know all the rules.

— How did you convince UNICS to allow you to play at the Games of the Future?

— It was actually my club that suggested it. Bogdan Bogachev, our sport director, came up to me and asked if I would be interested in representing the team. So I’m trying my best now.

— What esports are your favorite?

— Right now, I’m doing a digital detox, trying to read books and rest. The last digital championship I followed was Dacha, a major Dota 2 championship in Dubai. I’d worked with some of the players there, who ended up competing for third place.

— What about earlier?

— I followed CS and Dota. Mainly the disciplines where I worked.

‘I sold my gaming computer to avoid the temptation’

— You became immersed in esports in 2020 after you took a long break from your pro career. Was your mother’s illness the main reason?

— There were many factors involved, it was a complex story. I got great new experience and had a lot of fun. There were difficult moments as well, psychologically challenging. When you don’t have a clear idea how to proceed and are groping your way around in a new world.

I was appointed sport director of Virtus.pro and was asked to bring my expertise in the field of traditional sports to esport. The guys didn’t accept me at once because they didn’t know me. If you’re not from the Dota world, but just a good, celebrated athlete, you’re not an authority figure to them. But we gradually began to speak a common language.

— So you were off to a rocky start?

— Look, they have their own role models there. I wasn’t one of them because, figuratively speaking, I came from a different planet.

— How is their world different?

— It’s nothing like professional sport, but you need to understand that all these disciplines are only beginning to take shape. Esports are developing rapidly, but some things need time to settle. Even in traditional sports, not everyone is prepared to take psychology seriously, some clubs are not willing to work with these specialists.

— That is gradually changing.

— Yes, but basketball is more than a hundred years old, while esports are about 20. It just can’t get to the same level in a much shorter amount of time. Basketball used to be just some guys drinking beers and throwing a ball into a hoop, but it’s a huge industry now.

— Did you have to learn how to create a positive atmosphere in your team?

— I knew how to do that before. I had created my own teambuilding course and worked with young athletes, although I didn’t want to advertise it too much because it was all at a very early stage. I took that course to cybersports. I thought it would be a one-off thing, we’d just get together, give it a try, do come joint activities, and that’s it. But then I got an offer to become a sport director. So we set our priorities straight, divided responsibilities, and got to work.

— You also tried your hand as a commentator. Did that feel strange or unusual to you?

— I started with regular basketball. Was it strange... well, If you can follow what’s happening on the court and know how to put words together, then it’s no big deal. I guess I’m a fairly outspoken guy. I showed up, they put a microphone on me, and I just talked about my favorite game for two hours non-stop.

— Were you worried you might say something inappropriate?

— I am not a shy person. I can control my speech and I think I am a fairly competent talker. So I just got there and improvised. Plus I do know my basketball. After all, I’ve been a professional athlete since age 15, and I’ve crossed paths with almost everyone else on the court. I have ready-made stories about each of them, whether it’s from my own life or from my time spent with the guys. There was no fear or anxiety.

I guess I was somewhat nervous with DOTA, when we had to do streams from home because of the lockdowns. I had to do multiple things at once: streaming, commenting, acting as an observer, reading ads...

— How long do these streams typically last?

— Depends on the game and the number of matches played. Sometimes it’s just under four hours, but it could take up to eight.

— How do you handle that?

— There are short breaks when the teams can rest. You have 5-10 minutes to yourself, so you grab a snack and then go back to work.

— Wouldn’t you lose your voice working for so many hours at a time?

— I did, a couple of times when we used to do streams for the Americas. They have different time zones. I would start working at 8pm and finish at 4am.

— You no longer commentate these days, do you?

— No, as soon as I returned to basketball, I left that behind.

— You don’t play DOTA anymore, either?

— I even sold my gaming PC so I wouldn’t have the urge to use it. It was very time-consuming. And one more thing: when you learn the discipline inside out, the magic disappears. You don’t want to play yourself, because you are surrounded by the thing 24 hours a day. The guys are either on the computer themselves, or analyzing the matches, or just talking about the game.

‘I came back and ended up on the champions’ lineup’

 — Why did you choose to resume your career after such a long break?

— I was going through an existential crisis. Like a midlife crisis. I wanted to understand myself, my identity. Tried to figure out what I am good at besides sports, and what I will be doing in five years, when I can no longer play. Back then, I didn’t know if I was capable of anything else.

After finding my other talents, I calmed down and decided to make the most of the time I had left in basketball – and only then go try out other fun things. I’ll have time for all that. But basketball isn’t something I’ll be able to go back to.

— You don’t play that many games for UNICS. Wouldn’t you like to get on the court more often?

— Of course I want that. Once you no longer want to play, that means you’re done as an athlete. We have plenty of top athletes on our team, and we have some strong foreign players with decent contracts, so they should play, too. But that’s the problem – there is no place for me in the lineup. I do my best at practice so I can get the chance to play next time. Or should I just walk up to the team and say: “I’m terminating the contract, since I don`t get to play”?

— Do you miss your old life, when you managed your YouTube channel and did vlogging about basketball?

— I haven’t uploaded anything in a while. I rarely post on Telegram either. This season I’m going through a ‘detox’. I’m taking a break from everything.

— Why?

— Sometimes you just have to. All I do now is post links on social media, post short videos, but not very often.

— What’s changed?

— There are circumstances over which I have no control. And I have no interest in talking about that. Time will pass, I’ll go back to my channel and start maintaining my online presence. It’s not that I’ve lost the drive to do that, it’s just how things are right now.

— You have won almost every possible trophy in basketball. What motivates you now?

— I want to go on the court and do the work. What other motivation do you need?

— You won the EuroLeague, and now you’re mostly staying on the bench...

— I don’t have a specific goal in mind. It’s a way of life. I do dream about achieving athletic longevity, of staying healthy overall. I want to finish my career with dignity, show what I’m capable of.

I think I’m doing pretty well. I went away for a year and a half, then came back and ended up on the champions’ lineup. Yes, I don’t get to play that often. If I were on a different team, I’d probably show up on the court more often.

— You’ve mentioned athletic longevity. How long would you like to keep playing?

— As long as my health allows. And for now it does. I haven’t had any serious injuries so far.

— Is winning the EuroLeague the greatest sports achievement of your life?

— Since I’ve never played in the NBA, yes, it is. It is the most prestigious basketball competition on the continent.

— You didn’t play in the Final Four, although you did help the CSKA team in the playoffs. Did you watch the big game against Fenerbahce from the stands?

— The day before my flight to Berlin, I got my nose broken at practice when I caught an elbow in the face from a partner. But I still went to Germany with my teammates and was part of the extended roster.

— Did you immediately know that you wouldn’t play after the accident?

— My nose was basically bended to one side. They made a face guard for me, of course, I could play in it, but my face was swollen. It’s not very pleasant.

— What does an athlete feel in moments like that?

— It’s a routine situation. I was 25 years old at the time, and it seemed like my whole life was ahead of me, with lots of final matches to play.

— The deciding game against Fenerbahce ended up going into overtime. CSKA led by 20 points by halftime, but managed to lose the lead in the second half. Did you have any worries things might end not so well for them?

— No, we still had the psychological advantage. Victor Khryapa took the last shot of the game. He’s a basketball genius, I love the guy. One of the best people in the sport. I felt such intense emotions back then I don’t even remember some of the details. The adrenaline wiped parts of my memory clean.

— What did you feel when Khryapa made the deciding shot?

— A rush of emotions. We all jumped out of our seats. I think everyone’s heart rate was, like, 200 – including the spectators. You see, as a professional athlete, you always remain part of the team, even if you don’t play. And once we heard the horn, we rushed onto the court.

— Was CSKA the strongest team you played for?

— I guess so. We did win the EuroLeague.

— Which of your teammates did you have the most vivid memories of, from your games together?

— A lot of them. It’s not an individual sport, after all. We work together. The strongest captain in terms of keeping morale up is probably Khryapa. Andrey Vorontsevich is a player of unrivaled skill. We played with him in CSKA and UNICS. Miloš Teodosić is the best passer ever. Nando De Colo and Cory Higgins are some of the best scorers.

— And who would you say are the most dangerous opponents?

— Plenty of them, too. We faced off against Barcelona and other top teams. But it’s all been a long time ago. When you first arrive on the team and see all those stars around you, you can’t help but admire them at first. But once you’ve trained and played together, the charm goes away.

— When you moved to CSKA, did you also feel these emotions?

— Yes, but it passed very quickly. Because all of the guys there are normal, regular people. And there were warm and friendly vibes in the team.

— Who did you admire the most, at first?

— There wasn’t any idolizing of other players. I was basically learning the way things are done. It was exciting for me that so many people care about us, try to arrange best conditions possible for us. I was impressed by the overall skill of the team, by everyone’s professionalism. Many stood out for their personal qualities. For example, Khryapa, Vorontsevich, and Nikita Kurbanov are all super easy-going players who will always help you out and give you tips. I never felt any pressure or domineering from them. If you are a decent, reasonable person, you are not going to face hazing or anything like that.

— You have won the VTB United League three times. Which of the three victories is the most memorable?

— Probably the last one. For one thing, it came after my return, when I played for a different team. Previously, only CSKA took trophies, but now everything has changed. Secondly, it was the first time in UNICS history that the club won the title. So obviously, it was an incredibly important milestone for the team. Another memorable moment was the Russian Basketball Cup, which we won when I played for Parma in 2019. It was a thrill for me, because I played a lot back then and was very active. The finals were held in Nizhny Novgorod, and the home team also made it there. I don’t think I have to explain just how much support they were getting. But despite this, we still won.

— Is it true that you had to pay for your teammates at the banquet after the UNICS team became champions?

— Not at the banquet. It was one of our big parties. It just so happened that my bank card was chosen through a makeshift drawing of lots. But the total amount was not so bad, they didn’t have the chance to order much.

— Have you put any thought into what you will do after you finish your basketball career?

— I definitely do not see myself as a traditional coach, although I do have a fair amount of experience. I have a good memory, and I know a lot. I have worked and continue to work with some amazing professionals, from whom I learn a lot in terms of tactics, in terms of proper conduct in the locker room, in terms of organizing basketball training. I have all that in my head now. So I can always choose to come back to that part of my life.

But now there are lots of other basketball and basketball-related projects. For example, the media component of the VTB United League. I know they are waiting for me to join them.

Also, I am thinking of designing my own team-building program - to pass on the knowledge. I think that would make for an amazing project. Many teams are just not ready for it now, and we need to start with teenagers, with children. Nowadays, most of the communication has moved online. There is nothing wrong with that, but in order to communicate on the court, the boys need to know how to talk to each other. This, too, must be taught. We even have a special simulator to train communication skills. I have the entire program mapped out in several notebooks. All that’s left is to compile all the notes during the summer and try it out with a bunch of kids. There are lots of promising ideas and projects to work on. It’s not going to be boring, that’s for sure.