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Stalin-Hitler pact commemorated

Published: 23 August, 2009, 09:43
Edited: 18 September, 2010, 15:02


Soviet Foreign minister Vyacheslav Molotov conferring with Adolf Hitler (AFP photo)

Seventy years ago, on August 23, 1939, the Soviet Union and Nazi Germany signed the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact, an agreement which had a huge impact on the history of the 20th century.

 
17 COMMENTS
Marzipan6 August 23, 2009, 01:21 quote
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The article states, “Seen as a compromise with destiny in the Soviet Union, in the West the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact is often described as a deal with the devil. In addition to the pact, Moscow and Berlin also signed a secret protocol that divided Eastern Europe into German and Soviet spheres of influence.” The West does not criticise Moscow for trying to reach accommodation with Hitler; after all, it tried to do the same at Munich. But the goals of Munich and of MRP were entirely different. Munich tried to prevent war by misguidedly sacrificing Czech territorial integrity. By contrast, the MRP facilitated the outbreak of war by allowing Moscow and Berlin a free hand to divide Europe between them in accordance with the Pact’s secret protocol. It is this that West decries – the MRP was a thieves’ pact which tipped a cataract of horrors over the world, and under the terms of which the USSR and Third Reich would have remained allies were it not for the fact that Hitler was stupid enough to eventually attack Russia. But here’s the grossest hypocrisy of all: Moscow excuses its alliance with Hitler, calling it a “compromise with destiny.” Yet the same Moscow reserves its most rabid insults for Estonia and its small Baltic neighbours which, having endured Stalin’s mass atrocities of 1940-41 while they were neutral, fought within the framework of the German military in 1943-45 against the returning Soviet oppressors. Moscow’s pact with Hitler was a “compromise with destiny.” The Baltics, which never had a pact with Hitler at all but some of whose men individually chose to fight in the only military available to try to prevent the Red Army from returning to torture, deport and kill their loved ones and ravage their homes and their country, are called Nazis, fascists, criminals, barbarians, traitors, collaborators and any other similar epithet that Moscow can think of. Yet that was the Baltics “compromise with destiny.” Moscow’s hypocrisy is shameless.

clearwater August 23, 2009, 10:37 quote
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"and under the terms of which the USSR and Third Reich would have remained allies were it not for the fact that Hitler was stupid enough to eventually attack Russia." non-aggression pact, they have never been allies

Alex August 23, 2009, 12:48 quote
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@Marzipan ... western hypocrisy is far more shameless... you are shameless .. they are just using this situation to try and turn the attention away from themselves ...

Polak August 23, 2009, 14:57 quote
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It's very funny to listen to Molotow son saying that without pact with Hilter CCCP would be attack. With what Hitler would attack CCCP in 1939? Pact was agressive not defensive. With this pact CCCP occcupied Baltic staters, half of Poland, part of Romania and attacked Finland. And you people still claim it was to protect CCCP??? You think peolpe are stupid???

Gazza August 24, 2009, 07:13 quote
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Groan... yet more of Marzipans' historical revisionism, espousing the fable of the poor freedom loving peaceful balts victimised by the big bad evil baby-killing Russians. We should of course expect nothing less from a collection of minor nations whose prime characteristic seems to be nostalgia for their Nazi past, complete with anti-Slavic discrimination, Nazi-saluting musicians and annual parades of goose-stepping SS veterans.

Marzipan6 August 24, 2009, 08:50 quote
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When presented facts that contradict his world-view, instead of discussing and refuting these Alex chooses to mete out personal insults. Unfortunately this mirrors the pattern which Russian officialdom also often follows, and this does not advantage Russia.

Marzipan6 August 24, 2009, 09:01 quote
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Clearwater, the Pact’s secret protocol whereby Moscow and Berlin divided Europe between themselves and gave one another the green light to go on an invasion spree of their neighbours made the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact something much, much more than just a non-aggression treaty. For almost a full third of the War, Russia and Germany were allies in fact. The two participated in joint military actions, participated in joint military parades, were involved in some cross-training and Russia provided Germany with war materials and supplies. Not only was their pact the trigger which started off WW2, but until Germany attacked Russia, both parties helped one another in their military adventures. This is something Russians aren’t told, as it is very hard to explain away given Moscow’s subsequent “holier-than-thou” attitude in regard to the War. But that’s the way it was, regardless.

Marzipan6 August 24, 2009, 12:16 quote
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Gazza tells of “the fable of the poor freedom loving peaceful balts victimised by the big bad evil baby-killing Russians”. Fable? In the years leading up to WW2 Estonia followed a policy of strict neutrality. Seems like “freedom loving” and “peaceful” might be entirely appropriate adjectives in that context. Yet Soviet Russia invaded it despite this. And having overthrown the government and occupied the country, on 13 June Moscow issued the order to deport 10,000 people to Siberian slave camps. This order was put into effect in June 14-17, 1941. Approximately 8,000 civilians were deported in cattle wagons, where people began dying before the trains even crossed the border into Russia. Of the total number, a quarter were under 16 years of age, the youngest being a six weeks’ old baby. The oldest was a woman in her 90s. In fact, the majority of the deportees were women and children. And even larger deportations followed in 1949 and 1951. Most of them died in captivity. So very sadly, Gazza, Baltic people being victimised, in your words, by “big bad evil baby-killing Russians” is not altogether a fable. Although I have always chosen more respectful terms myself when discussing Russian actions in the Baltics, since my wish is for reconciliation to happen. But reconciliation has to be based on truth, not on more lies.

Zak August 27, 2009, 06:18 quote
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Your comments are complete rubish! Lets look that pact from today point of Nato-Russia PARTNERSHIP FOR PEACE!1)Nato -millitary alliance moving west(same as nazis) 2)Nato-proofen aggresive(as nazis) pact-not deffensive one(Bosnia,Serbia,Kosovo,Iraq,Afganistan)with public plan to become global... 3)They leader is Usa(worse than nazis)-well known state living on stolen land after commitet genocide on 50000 plus old native people,droping nuclear bombs(a terrorist state) on Japan for fun and experiment.They make 72 intervention and kill 23 millions innorcent people from 1945.They also fake moon landing,WMD in Iraq and 9/11(1000 of hard evidence),dilling in drugs(Columbia,Afganistan,Albania,Kosovo)wich bring them 70-80 billions a year.They also rape,burn,burry alive their victims(as nazis)They also run hiden prison camps(as nazis)in Europe and around the world.They also plan more threath to Russia by puting missiles in(same as nazi) Poland...4)Other states aline themself with this Nato(nazis)policy.They wage a proxy war agains (as nazis)Russia citizens in Georgia killing kids in their beds at 3 am-i think Barbarosa start at 4am.(you probable are not aware how you been close to perish).Nato(Baltic) also fake the history and put murrderer in a grave with victim?!Russia by time to prepare(its happend-they are ready and wait for you to cross the line)..Can you call Nato(nazis)-Russia( SU) "partnership for peace" any other name than "A COMPROMISE WITH DESTINY"???- a perfect title indeed..only one small difference-next time when you met your finale DESTINY -it will be quick and a painless one-(they warn you many times in last 17 years-but you did not listen)and nothing to worry about...so who ever survive can finaly live in peace, without watching your endless every day genocide ...

Marzipan6 August 29, 2009, 01:27 quote
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Zak, we weren’t talking about the NATO Partnership for Peace. We were talking about the Soviet Union.

Zak August 29, 2009, 19:11 quote
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Marzipan6-I know that..I make a point to compare those two "pact""wich are to the bone same! You know2 world war in Russia start 1938-1939 by Japan attack on SU in far east..Japan lost that war in Mongolia! Germany and Japan plan was, to link their armys true Siberia and Russia! Hitler attack on Poland was 2 weeks after-Hitler wait to see outcome of that war(Japan v Russia). Japan lost war, and Hitler was force to make a offer-peace "pact" to Russia. Russia just "play" along! By doing that Russia have time to prepare for war wich come on 22 june 1941-again as many time before !It was "A COMPROMISE WITH DESTINY"!A DESTINY wich will depent only (again) and sole by west"Today as you know Russia prepare again ! Their bombers are in air 24/7 on Patrol-always 20-30 km from Nato states,nuclear subs(15-20)are 24/7 ready to act in lest then 1 minute!They also fitt their weapons with-anty gravity,plasma,radio waves,nano weapons .They put also new space weapons ! They adopt a policy(much worse than Nato-righfully)-A president can order a nuclear(and other weapons)atack any moment without warning to anyone!Those weapons can in lest than 1 hour finish all Nato 20 times over-there in no protection from attack .For all of this (as before to west-Hitler nazi Europe) we can thanks Nato-west(worse than nazis)!As before world risk total wipe out thanks to wrong and aggresive policy of the west!A Nazi-SU pact is today Nato-Russia pact for"peace"-a copy cat -A COMPROMISE WITH DESTINY-INDEED! One small wrong move...or accidental mistake all world (this time complete) will die! Thanke you genocide west(from slavery till today)-you will bring as a "freedom and liberty" forever!

Iceman September 02, 2009, 04:15 quote
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Zak, i believe your reading more sci-fi than history.... i mean really? nano weapons? anti-gravity? hahaha. no you must be reading about battlestar galactica or something.... russia is no more a threat in conventional war to the us than a fly is to a spider. ill give russia credit for all the nukes though.

peter gill September 08, 2009, 03:02 quote
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I always thought Latvia and Estonia were pro -German until Germany started to lose. They then became pro-Russian. Now their pro-European. Or are they pro-American?Which ever way the wind blows.

S O'Neill January 01, 2010, 01:36 quote
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Marzipan6 & Polak talk utter claptrap I doubt if they even googled the word 'Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact' before espousing their well worn tiresome tirade of rightwing drivel "The West does not criticise Moscow for trying to reach accommodation with Hitler" Yeah thats right Marzi! It fumes because Russia won even after loosing over 20 million of its peoples! People here in England lost just 450.000 for crying out loud Your lot in the 3 Baltics lost 409.000 of which 49% approx were Holocaust deaths Probably people grassed in to the Nazi's by the "freedom loving” Baltic citizens So cork and park it!

raaj March 09, 2010, 10:38 quote
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One great strain of the Anglo-Saxon mind is Inquisitiveness and In-ate Quiriosity..about others, and, their culture and' how??..they..solve..their.problems.!! etc. Having set their 'economy' and 'internal-politics' in order, or rather 'semi-order'...they, can now , observe and 'study' the effects on the 'Bear" ..and the Turbaned-Monkey..and the 'panda' ..and also the other animals on the perifery. I don't think any other 'culture' other than the Anglo-sxn is as devoted to this 'interesting' study, to this extent, and with similar 'zest' !!

Team B September 18, 2010, 14:41 quote
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/peter gill sez: I always thought Latvia and Estonia were pro -German until Germany started to lose. They then became pro-Russian./ By "pro-" you mean "territory occupied by" ? :D Because otherwise your statement just makes no sense. Latvia and Estonia were pro-Latvian/pro-Estonian. Oh and nice propaganda article, but then propaganda is what this website is about.

Peter December 10, 2011, 00:18 quote
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I dont believe on a double game more about intresst of third partys what find arguments that bring this total war. A japanease/german/russian spy wrote to both Stalin and Hitler that nobady want attack the other. How intressting he worked for both and wanted no war between both. Other that not understand why 1 rst worldwar get lost and later flee with illusions to what now BRD. Had more influence special in by a brother in oversea. Their was a time where Hitler is shown as crazy the reason why is the argument that he called his lametter (swords&brilliants) traiters sometimes with blue blood and frinds in britan, canada, swiss, and USA. I think the only mistake but the heaviest was that Hitler and Stalin not met them self. Stalin set on Molotov but his name was known so his ability too and when someone want check you play gaddafi in UNO. Same with Ribbentrop and Stalin. When fear and Stratgie becomes more importent than old parnership millitary training in georgia under versailes dictate than all what comes going logical. Japan wanted attack america never russia in reasons of enhonoring and islands so america set all they had her is importent "mein kampf" to bring step by step with a tarned/not official war brothers against. Japanease was alone india going free britan going down in economical words it couldnt run better.

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